Second Skirmish

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AlreadyPicked
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Second Skirmish

Post by AlreadyPicked » Fri Mar 20, 2015 3:26 pm

Well, this time again with 3 players.

We set up the table and then remembered that there was some scenarios included. Since no one had really read them, and the setup didn't quite fit, we invented one. We had a big stone gazebo in the middle. The player with the most points inside (character value minus FOR and MIND loss) would win at the end of round 6.

It was pretty fun all around! I didn't like the mega strong/tough monster with a two-handed weapon that could knock back and prone all. I cannot find any strategies to bring him down.

Plus, the shields are very useful. A little too much I think. It's like a "Prevent a wound automatically" for a single point.

ST_Carl
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Re: Second Skirmish

Post by ST_Carl » Fri Mar 20, 2015 5:58 pm

That sounds like a fun scenario!

:)

Can you give me more details about the two-handed weapon armed monster knocking everyone prone?

I'm assuming that this model had high ATK so was getting multiple attack dice. To knock everyone prone it must have been in a confined space where there wasn't room for the 2" Force Back from a monster attack. I can imagine it would be very effective in a tight spot.

Was this the case - was it fighting in a small area?

Did the monster never lose initiative for the controlling warband?

Being a monster (rolling on the behaviour chart) and using a two-handed weapon so having to apply every dice in an attack I'd expect it to lose initiative at least once.

A couple of things that may have been useful against the monster would have been psychological attacks such as Intimidate, Taunt or Distract. The other thing which may have been useful is a shield bash to knock the model off it's feet. Another option would have been concentrated missile fire to Force Back the model away from it's position of strength (a couple of slingers in close range can really move models if you get your angles right). Yet another approach would have been to not engage it so that it had to move to attack, use spears/halberds so that you could attack it but it couldn't attack back without moving. There's lots of possibilities.

With regards to shields they're useful but not auto-prevention - can you give me an example please?

In the right situations they can be good. Open Combat is incredibly situational so as a game develops occasions may arise that are tricky to deal with but there's usually something that can be done. It depends on the build of each warband, the scenario and the terrain setup and where each player attempts to exploit or capitalise on opportunities.

AlreadyPicked
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Re: Second Skirmish

Post by AlreadyPicked » Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:23 pm

Yeah, I realized now that the prone thing was not used correctly. D'oh! It was indeed a very confined area but my guys were positioned so that 2 inches could be made when knocked back.

Also, the monster had a very high attack value. That meant that even if he rolled a couple of "ones", he never lost the initiative. What is it that you mean by "[...] using a two-handed weapon so having to apply every dice in an attack I'd expect it to lose initiative at least once [...]. Does it mean that he has to apply all the dice, even the "ones"? Does it apply to all close combat weapons?

As for your strategies, well, it was hard to get a shot inside the gazebo and he was almost always engaged. He also had a good Mind so psych attacks would have been tedious but feasible. Also, can the Shield Bash work on a monster if it's made from a normal sized model?

What I meant by preventing wounds automatically is when knocked back. In two games, I'm guessing around a third of the wounds inflicted were because of models being knocked back into other models or scenery. Having a shield keeps you from getting those only for 1 point. We find it extremely cheap :)

ST_Carl
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Re: Second Skirmish

Post by ST_Carl » Wed Mar 25, 2015 4:12 pm

AlreadyPicked wrote:Also, the monster had a very high attack value. That meant that even if he rolled a couple of "ones", he never lost the initiative. What is it that you mean by "[...] using a two-handed weapon so having to apply every dice in an attack I'd expect it to lose initiative at least once [...]. Does it mean that he has to apply all the dice, even the "ones"? Does it apply to all close combat weapons?
Yes - all dice are scored with a double-handed weapon, even the 1s and 2s, it's the balancing element to it. You want a model with a high attack to get the most use out of it thus potentially damaging multiple enemy with one action but on the flip side rolling more dice means that you have more chance of rolling a 1.

You can read more on Page 23 second column, Double-handed weapon, third para starting,"All attack dice are scored in hand-to-hand combat..."

It's a rule specific to double-handed weapons.
AlreadyPicked wrote: As for your strategies, well, it was hard to get a shot inside the gazebo and he was almost always engaged. He also had a good Mind so psych attacks would have been tedious but feasible. Also, can the Shield Bash work on a monster if it's made from a normal sized model?
Shield Bash does work on monsters/cavalry.

A Shield Bash isn't necessarily simply a 'punch' with the boss of the shield as the various fighters of antiquity probably did. It could also be a smash with the rim of the shield under the chin of a similar sized enemy or on an important joint on a large foe.

The way I see it is that if I'm faced with a large enemy such as a 10' tall ogre or a guy on a horse. The way I'm going to equalise things is smashing the kneecap of the ogre with steel-edged rim of a shield or taking the joint of a horses foreleg with the edge.

If either approach were successful it would bring the foe down or at least an equivalent form of temporary disablement.
AlreadyPicked wrote:What I meant by preventing wounds automatically is when knocked back. In two games, I'm guessing around a third of the wounds inflicted were because of models being knocked back into other models or scenery. Having a shield keeps you from getting those only for 1 point. We find it extremely cheap :)
Don't forget the shield only works from attacks emanating from the front facing - getting around opponents and scoring Force Backs from their blind side gets around the shield.

We found that the benefit of a shield is soon lost if two models attack the same enemy model. One going in at the front the other 'surrounding' the enemy and attacking from the rear. One of my favourite approaches is to have several cheap models (10 ish Renown) in conjunction with some heavier hitters. The job of the low grade models is to get around the rear and score cheap shots in the enemies back when a more robust fighter engages from the front.

Blocked Force Backs can be a big part of causing FOR loss on your enemies and as you say, a Shield is a good way to help combat this possibility but only when you can keep your enemy in front of you.

:)

AlreadyPicked
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Re: Second Skirmish

Post by AlreadyPicked » Thu Mar 26, 2015 3:10 am

Thanks for clearing the two-handed dice roll rule.

Also, nice strategy to surround an enemy with a shield!

Woodenhorse
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Re: Second Skirmish

Post by Woodenhorse » Thu May 07, 2015 5:21 pm

If someone hasn't mentioned it all ready (knowing my luck they probably have!) an ability like taunt would be really usefull to get that big monster out of the control point.

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